Black don't crack. Guess how old she is.
I was sitting at my desk as I normally do when someone gchats the good Doctor and says, “Hey check this article out.” I sat there for a few minutes reading this article that Tracy McMillan wrote and I nodded my head to each point. I was so in tune with each of her points that I began to want to be her fourth husband. However, once completing the article, I like many of you thought to myself, “This might be the greatest blog of the year.”
Tracy gave six reasons why a woman isn’t married: You’re a b*tch, you’re shallow, you’re a slut, you’re a liar, you’re selfish, and/or you’re not good enough.
If it hadn’t have been a woman this article would not have been as well received, because I cannot tell you how many times men say these same exact things to women on the regular and get the ultimate #nosign. For some reason, men aren’t smart enough to develop thoughts like these six points that Tracy came up with. In my mind, I was just thinking, I’ve been saying this to women for years. If the Get Over It series yielded anything, it was to tell you that. “You’re the reason why you’re in the situation that you’re in.”
What’s so weird to me is that there are so many women who will tell me, (because I’m not sleeping with them), that they have these problems. However, if you ask any of the ones who I’ve considered dating and decided against it, they won’t admit to any of these. Yes, I’ve had women tell me to my face, “I’m just too into me right now to want to be married.” But, those women won’t admit that in public. Or maybe I should say they’d rather tell you that they are a b*tch rather than you telling them.
It makes me think of this quote by the big homie Kain, “How come whenever you ask me for some money and I don’t have it, you call me a broke n*gga? Correct me if I’m wrong, but if you’re asking me for money, doesn’t that make you a broke b*tch?” #iDied. It’s so true, but what’s also true is that if you ever call a woman, a nagging woman, who is also broke, “a broke b*tch” it might be the last words you ever say. And I think for that reason that’s why women were more willing to take the words from Tracy than from a man.
I do think there were two reasons that she didn’t talk about; Bad timing and You don’t really want to be married. It should be noted that a lot of women claim to want to be married, but don’t do anything to put themselves in a position to be married. I had a conversation with a friend one time and I told her why she should stop going out. You know in the minds of most women between the ages of 21-27, they aren’t trying to settle down, they want to have fun. And it doesn’t seem to matter to them when they are told, this may be fun now, but trust me, none of us guys want to marry that girl who was in the club with us during those years. We want someone who has not been around so much. But those same women insist that they want to be married one day, but they just don’t show any signs of being able to put themselves in a wifeable situation.
And then there was bad timing, and I think it should be noted that for some people when your time came, your circumstances didn’t permit you to get married. I just think of all the women who “date” men into their thirties and then find out he’s not the one for you, or you log into Facebook and find out that he’s engaged. “But he said he wasn’t looking for a relationship!” Or what about when family gets in the way of your 20s and 30s. I’ve seen a few instances where someone’s family commitments caused them to lose a real good person in their lives. Since women are expected to be caretakers and typically end up being the one to take care of an aging relative, they miss out on some things in life.
Anyway, I’m interested to hear the SBM Massive’s thoughts on the article. I want to say that I’m happy Tracy wrote the article, I thought it was spot on. I think that anyone who refutes her article is part of the problem. If that didn’t apply to you, I’m pretty sure you know some people in your circle who it did apply to. What were your thoughts about the article? Was it on point? Do you think she left something out?
Minor note: Tracy McMillan and Terry McMillan are two different people. I saw someone who went IINNN on her books the other day and I kind of just sat there like, “You ain’t got no clue what you’re talking about.”
*Standing ovation*
I think this has been one of your best written work besides Free Ass Laundry.
That is is my sista from anotha motha right there! I read her article and like you Dr. J, I was like, plain and simple….Truth.
Everybody on here probably knows I've been married before..and divorced. I am not actively seeking a husband right now..I am not totally against it though. but, if I were one of those women who is constantly going on about marriage and why not me…I would consider all of her points and see where I fall in…..somewhere in there is the number one reason you are not married yet.
Excellent post J.
I read the article and thought, "This is one poignant, provocative sista." We are the cause in the matter of our lives – so you want to be married, you will check married. To be in any kind of relationship, you have to be authentic. Keep it real so you don't need a reality check.
As for your addendum, think "really does not to be married" is a corollary to shallow/selfish reasons. Timing is everything.
Great post!
as much as i laughed at/agreed with Tracy McMillian's article…you kinda nailed it…for almost all relationships…it's up to timing, and it's up to the people involved to decide that they actually want to be in the relationship.
Cosign
You’re a b*tch, you’re shallow, you’re a slut, you’re a liar, you’re selfish, and/or you’re not good enough.
LOL….i love efficiency
I read that article. How old IS she?
GREAT ARTICLE! I totally agree with her.
Great post Dr. J. Can't wait to see the comments on this one…lol.
I read the article and thought it was very good. I'm definitely the liar. Just was wondering if she knew so much why was she divorced three times? (or maybe that is why she knows so much) Anybody can just get married, but the work comes in actually "staying" married. Any tips on that?
Good post. And I'm gonna guess she's around… 45?
I am not a marriage expert however; I have plenty of examples in my family. Here are some suggestions given to me by the married men and women in my circle:
Learn when to yield – being right or trying to get your point across is not going to make for a happy marriage. Choose your battles wisely!
Keep your own life but not to the detriment of your marriage – self explanatory.
Think about what the family needs versus what YOU need – The husband and children have to be considered when making all decisions.
Talking it out is not necessary all the time – when disagreeing, women seem to be naturally incline to want to talk everything out…most men are not. There are two different styles of communications involved in ANY marriage…learn your husband's!
Have sex OFTEN and then some more – things will calm down a bit after the honeymoon phase (average about 1-2 years) but if you allow it—your sex life will become null and void. Be sure to make this a priority!
Don't let PRIDE ruin you and your marriage – This really applies to everything stated above and then some. Pride kills everything, its like rust. You don’t have to prove anything in your marriage and neither does your husband. You are ONE.
Marriage is between TWO people – keep negative thoughts and people away as much as possible. However, we all need help so learn to be discerning when seeking advice. Maybe keeping an older married aunt/uncle (doesn't have to be blood family) on call will help during those trying times.
You and your husband have to create you own boundaries within the marriage – don’t compare your marriage to others or look to the media for guidance. You will never be happy doing that because there is always something more appealing somewhere. Be content with your life and add on what you feel is lacking.
Good answer. This is no shade to Tracey because I loved her article but I notice a high number of divorced/single people giving relationship advice or reasons as to why other's aren't married. The irony. I am always searching for advice from married writers or people who are in-relationships who can give advice on HOW to work through couple issues. Great points mommy Bacon. 🙂
Yeah, I noticed that too. Though, I am sure a lot can be learned from those that have been there and done that however, since my goal is to have a happy marriage, I'd seek advice from happily married couples and happily married couples with children.
Our bovine porcine marriage expert dropped some knowledge here! Especially:
"Talking it out is not necessary all the time – when disagreeing, women seem to be naturally incline to want to talk everything out…most men are not. There are two different styles of communications involved in ANY marriage…learn your husband’s!"
Women like to talk things out. Men like to think things through. If we do talk, we will do our best and try to say exactly what we mean, upfront. The more you try to get us to talk, the more likely we'll say something we don't really mean.
Good Points
@ Beef Bacon, great points/advice
You shared this article with me, I believe, the day you read it. I agree, but Im a man so my vote is probably discounted or counts for not. Anyway, this quote right here!!!
"It should be noted that a lot of women claim to want to be married, but don’t do anything to put themselves in a position to be married."
GREATEST QUOTE OF ALL TIME!
As a side note, thanks for pointing out that "Tracy McMillan and Terry McMillan are two different people." When I saw McMillan in the title I was scared for you at first, sir. I thought you had transitioned over to the dark side – no pun intended – since I know you like the Latinas.
Side note, 1) Tracy is some kind of mature-FINE man. I might have to be her FIF husband after she gets threw with you. 2) she's on Twitter if you want to @'m or dap'm on this write-up (if you havent already)
"It should be noted that a lot of women claim to want to be married, but don’t do anything to put themselves in a position to be married.”
Pray tell, what position is this? Not being nasty, really wanting you and J's interpretation of the "the position for marriage".
I actually want all three of y'all (Dr. J, Starita, & WIM) to explain this in your own words
Hmmm, I guess…available, respectable, honest, communicative, stable, reliable, accommodating, fully formed personality and opinions, and compatible with the prospective mate, off the cuff. Of course it depends a lot on what each perspective mate is looking for…
I should thank Star because basically the exact opposite of the things she said. I don't know why she asked to begin with, if she already knew the answer.
But in my opinion, it's real simple, the women who don't look or resemble or even want to be anything a man looks for in a wife.
Example: If you are out in the streets all the time, whether you be at the club or at church, you are not showing me that you will be able to take care of a home or be a good mother. You're not marriage material. On the contrary, if you are always up in the house, then you don't have the personability to date a man like me. When we go out, you'll be awkward and not fit into my network.
I think that between ages 25-29, most of the women that I would say are not putting themselves in a position to be married are doing the following:
1) Still playing childish games. Moreover, they don't strike me as a woman, but rather a girl who is still responding to something they read in a magazine or saw on TV.
2) They sleep around way too much.
3) They are focused on their career to the point of exhaustion.
3b) They are NOT focused on their career to the point of non-existence. Women who lack no direction in life will never be married.
4) Their relationships with their friends and/or social organizations are overwhelming.
5) When they have a man they believe in the "push and pull" approach to compromise. (For men this means: They won't STFU.)
6) They teeter on the brink of failure. This can be a woman who needs to work out, or needs to stop leaving the house looking like almost a hot mess, or someone who constantly has drama. And I FEEL real bad for them, I do, because there are some people who just have horrible luck. Friends and family always pulling you into something, or just generally it just never seems to go your way, but men tend to stay away from these women until they figure out how to effectively manage their lives to avoid failure.
I asked because I wanted to know the men's (including yours) answer.
I answered because it was asked of me.
22 year old, black male, NYC who HATES divorce law (the main thing keeping me from getting a wife), but
PRO-long-term-high-quality relationship
And again, I would love if women address the divorce laws the OVERWHELMLY benefit them in western society… But I know that will fall on deaf ears…
Pre-Marriage Positioning
– Keep your body count low (eliminates ALOT of women out here in this day & age, but IDGAF)
– UpStanding Character Is Paramount
– Sexual polarity aka Be A WOMAN (femininity),
– Women were made to support men, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND… So, if you are looking for me to complete your puzzle… No bueno…
This is such a good question if I have any more i will Gchat you…
Good Discussion…
@Starita34:
I cant speak for Dr. J, he's his own man. But what you said, "Hmmm, I guess…available, respectable, honest, communicative, stable, reliable, accommodating, fully formed personality and opinions, and compatible with the prospective mate, off the cuff. Of course it depends a lot on what each perspective mate is looking for…" Is all fine and dandy and I agree with all of it.
However, you've gone way further than my original intent. As I said in my thoughts to SFG, most women are aware of what you described above, that should be common sense (not that sense is all that common – another issue) but I was simply saying a lot of women waste their time with men who don't have the same goals as themselves. Period. We can debate all day long about why they do this but at the end of the day, whether I'm right or you're right, you'll still be un-married
It's like this: I've used this metaphor before because it's simple. (Substitute whatever restaurants you want if you want to be bougie or your vegan…)
If you want a Whopper, you can't go to McDonalds and order it. You also shouldn’t be upset with McDonalds because they don't have 'Whopper' (marriage) on the menu. If you want a Whopper, YOU either need to go to Burger King or YOU need to change what you want to what is on McDonald's menu. The fact that you "love" McDonalds is independent of the fact that McDonalds doesn't offer what you want. Your choices are not restricted, you are imposing the restriction on yourself. If you plan on sitting around until McDonalds decides to put Whopper on the menu when the competition is already offering it, then I find that to be a very unintelligent approach.
I'm sure I'm the crazy one. *shrugs*
Excellent metaphor. That makes good sense. I'm much more emotional about my men than my hamburgers though lol
Really though, that makes sense…and in that sense, I'm in position…I loved McDonald's very much…but he just didn't have what I wanted, so I left.
But J was right about being on the brink…this does apply to me, however I see lots of women (and men) that this applies to that get married all the time…but like I said, I guess every person's definition will be personal.
Thanks for the responses guys.
"You also shouldn’t be upset with McDonalds because they don’t have ‘Whopper’ (marriage) on the menu. "
I love this analogy!
Ya know, I glanced over the Tracy article and didn't think much of it. I just re-read it and I have to say it is indeed one of the greatest of all time posts. I think a lot of people got so caught up in the words she chose to use (b*tch, slut, etc.) that they missed the real message. I also found myself wondering where do women from like 21-30ish really rank character when considering booski types.
I just counted on one hand how many times I've heard a lady friend excited by a man's moral compass more so than his ability to make her…well, you know the rhyming punch line I was about to throw in here.
"I also found myself wondering where do women from like 21-30ish really rank character when considering booski types."
Ok… Ok…. I will admit I am shallow. But I'm working on it!
Hey its hard to judge the moral compass when you first meet a man since you are meeting his representative but very easy to judge appearance. lol!
Alot of young women are not into character… It's sad, but true, alot of young men aren't think about it either
<i.I also found myself wondering where do women from like 21-30ish really rank character when considering booski types. </i>
I rank it above everything else. Women(and men) have been conditioned to think a good resume makes a good man. Men waste their youth trying to get the degrees, job, money, etc., instead of working on being a man of honor and integrity. And women look for all those outside accolades as a sign of a good man instead of looking at what really matters. A good man/good woman is a good person first. Most of us forget about that… Men and women…
co-signage to N.I.A
Character is very high on my list, I may not list it when someone ask me but I look for it when Im dating. There's always certain clues that stick out to let me know.
So how in the blue hell can Steve "err body luvs cookies" Harvey and his mustache get a book deal about relationships that's a bunch of BS [Jimi Izrael and Hill Harper can fit under that bus too] and she can't?
I'd rather hear someone tell it like it is than read through 200+ pages of fluff and nonsense. Great article!
Eddie,
She's got a book it's called, "I love you and i'm leaving you anyway" It's on Amazon.
D'oh!
*slaps fo'head*
thanks J!
Excellent book title, I already know I'd love that one <del>and cry reading it</del>.
"How? It basically comes down to this: I've been married three times. Yes, three. To a very nice MBA at 19; a very nice minister's son at 32 (and pregnant); and at 40, to a very nice liar and cheater who was just like my dad, if my dad had gone to Harvard instead of doing multiple stints in federal prison."
She's 45 or 46. I'm going with 45, because you should always guess on the low side.
That's about where I had her pegged as well. I just thought you knew for a FACT how old she was. I did the math too but figured you had an exact figure to my guesstimate.
Oh well…she looks good for her age. I never hate on beauty.
I've always maintained that I'm not someone scrambling to be married, and most likely because, whether I'm 26 or 36 I just don't really fear not getting married…but I really really enjoyed McMillan's piece because it was insanely realistic. I've been all or more than one of each of the types of womens she's described in my young adult life. Further, I still am holding onto some of the negative traits. And even though I think age naturally sheds some of the qualities, I still believe that if I were ready to be someones wife right this minute I would be.
Also, I know some of you women have the "no cart before the horse" mentality, but she was SPOT the fuck ON about motherhood. I was once terribly misguided and under the impression that motherhood before marriage would somehow lessen my stock in the dating pool as well as force me to have to lower my standards. That is completely and totally false. Some of the best men I've ever had the pleasure of knowing have been wholeheartedly interested in long term relationships with me post having my twins. I mean plum AMAZING men. I felt honored to have been object of their interest, honestly. Unfortunately, like I said before, I'm not ready to be anyones wife, so I've squandered some good opportunities, but they new ones haven't stopped being available. And I doubt they will.
Great post, DrJ.
Very good article by Tracy. I had to forward to a bunch of friends. I don't mind her terminology because it's time to get down to the nitty gritty when it comes to truth. There was part of me that was thinking I know alot of married women who posess the b*tchy, shallow and selfish traits she spoke of. The fact that she's been married 3 times didn't miss me either. I mean, getting married can happen if you want it bad enough but staying married is another part of equation as I would like to have a happy marriage.
The only part of her post that I disagreed with was this: "The problem is not men, it's you. Sure, there are lame men out there, but they're not really standing in your way. Because the fact is — if whatever you're doing right now was going to get you married, you'd already have a ring on it."
– Now yes and no. I can tell you that I know ALOT of women who would make excellent wives (their men even tell them so) yet the man refuses to marry them…and alot of these men don't say "No I don't want to be married" they say "My money isn't right or bad timing, maybe next year" So the woman stays because overall she loves the man. Don't underestimate the power of love in a women equals a certain level of loyalty. It takes TWO people to get married and the blame doesn't lie only on the woman's shoulders. Also, not all men who are slow to the alter are "lame" and not all women who fail to get the ring are the problem. Like you said, sometimes it's the situation and other factors that get in the way. I know who I am and I know my worth. My man has no complaints yet no ring. I realize that HE may not be ready and maybe I don't have the stamina to wait any longer, plus 300mi inbetween doesn't help. It's a decision I have to make because I refuse to get married only to divorce later. I want a happy marriage. I found that statement in her article to be a bit pressumptious. Other than that, good read.
SmartFox –
The fact is, staying with a man who won't marry you is not going to get you married. So you in fact described what she said in that point. Whether your reason is love or whatever, it's still not going to get you married. That's sort of what I was talking about when I said not putting yourself in a position to be married. I know too many women who stay with men through the excuses or the "reasons".
If money is the issue, a marriage license costs $50-$75. Have at it. If you're staying with a guy "who doesn't want to be married" then you don't want to be married either, why else would you stay with him?
You're absolutely right. I understand that. In fact, I agree with your additions as you included what Tracey's article lacked. I'd like to think of myself as intelligent and marriage worthy but unfortunately not all of us think with a clear head. Many other emotions can cloud my judgement as I am loyal to a fault. I left him for a year to date but I didn't spend much me time to reflect. Now we're back together and while qualities are there to make a good marriage, the arguing has increased due to the distance and unrealistic expectations of one another. I made a decision to leave over the weekend. To be honest, I didn't want to leave but I did it as a duty to myself. I'm heart broken but I'm going to spend some time alone and do things differently this time. My only point is that love is a very strong emotion for women. A side effect of love is loyalty.
We want to see the good in the men we are with. Sometimes this clouds are judgement and we neglect ourselves and our own needs. This is real life. Also, there are many relationships out there that are healthy yet no ring. Do you leave a good man because he won't propose? Many say so. Like I said, it's important to me to have a happy marriage rather than just getting married. It's very easy to tell a woman that it's her and she needs to leave. Saying and doing are two different things. Life isn't easy like that. Knowing someone for 10 years has a hold on you mentally. With all that said, I'm in no way naive and I will do what I have to do. I just wanted people to know that it's not always black and white.
@SmartFoxGirl:
"My only point is that love is a very strong emotion for women. A side effect of love is loyalty.
We want to see the good in the men we are with. Sometimes this clouds are judgment and we neglect ourselves and our own needs. This is real life. Also, there are many relationships out there that are healthy yet no ring. Do you leave a good man because he won’t propose? Many say so. Like I said, it’s important to me to have a happy marriage rather than just getting married. It’s very easy to tell a woman that it’s her and she needs to leave. Saying and doing are two different things. Life isn’t easy like that.
Smart I don't know you from a hole in the ground so take my comments for a grain of salt but I figured I'd jump in here as a man and because I believe you're honestly saying what a lot of women (and lurkers) are thinking, given my experiences with women.
*deep bracing breath*
Like most women, I kind of feel like you're saying what you should do while neglecting your own sounds thoughts. In other words, you seem to recognize the "logical" thing to do but instead fall back on your heart – not a bad thing. For example, you say "We want to see the good in the men we are with. Sometimes this clouds are judgment and we neglect ourselves and our own needs. This is real life." — this is contradictory. Of course you're neglecting yourself because within the same sentence you're giving the power to someone else. Concerning the last point, "this is real life." Arguably, life is what you make of it; thus, you can define the reality.
Further, you state: "Also, there are many relationships out there that are healthy yet no ring. Do you leave a good man because he won’t propose? Many say so. Like I said, it’s important to me to have a happy marriage rather than just getting married." The simple answer to this is yes and here's why: If you're looking for a marriage – which you seem to be doing – but you're basing it on the potential for marriage, this is flawed. I'll revert this back to me for a second, plenty of women should have left my ass plenty of months/years before they did, because the relationship wasn’t going anywhere or at least not where they wanted it to go. To define that you're looking for a "happy marriage" rather than "just getting married" implies there will be a marriage to be had. The absence of the proposal negates the latter. In other words, a man has to want to marry you or yes, in my opinion, you are waisting your time, regardless of how "good a man" he may be. A good man doesn't always equate to a husband or a lot more men and women would be married. I'm more of a proponent of if a woman wants to get married she should date a man that wants to be married, not defining the period for if you'll wait is debatable – but women underestimate men's ability to determine who and when they'll get married. If you leave him – and define that you want to be married – he will come for you. If he doesn't, there's your answer. I feel many women (not just you) avoid that answer by instead staying in the safer gray area of the pseudo-relationship because they’ve found a “good man” but as I said earlier, good man and husband are not necessarily one in the same. Perhaps, it would be more accurate to separate the two: do you want a good man or a husband or both? If both, in my opinion, you need to change your approach, as you have only satisfied one of these requirements.
Anyway, sorry for this book and sorry I directed this at you as I believe it applies to a much larger audience. Feel free to curse me out, if necessary. lol
Thanks for reminding me that it is just not black & white…
But as long as you have choices & able to make decisions… That is what matters to me…
#NoSympathy Do the right thing…
@WIM
Thanks for making me cry at work. That's not cool. lol You don't know me but you hit the nail on the head. With me, I'm actually not ignorant. That's what makes my girlfriends want to scream, the fact that I do know better. I'm just trying to be honest with myself and my emotions. My intelligence tells me one thing but my heart says another. I've battled logic/love for 11 years. The only time he proposes is when I threaten to leave and who wants that? Obviously it's not a priority for him. I ask myself if I'm willing to forego marriage just to be with him and the answer is no, so yes I'm looking to be married in the future. I want both. A good man who wants to be married. You wanna know something that's gonna make you want to punch me in the throat? I know plenty of men who sincerely want to be with me AND get married who I've pushed aside for my ex. Like I said, 11 years. I've let so many good men go while waiting and hoping on this man. I'm a hot mess, I know. I can't even complain that there aren't any good men out there because there are. I know I need to get my head together. Thanks for the advice.
That last comment was CLASSIC… Thanks for keeping it 100 SFG, I'm sure it is therapeutic for you… You have been saying what men have been saying for the longest…
When it comes to love
WOMEN SHOOT THEMSELVES IN THE FOOT ALL THE TIME…
And to keep it 100 on my side… all the women who passed me up in the past..
DON'T COME BACK HERE ASKING FOR SOME COMMITMENT especially after some sorry a** negro smutted you out (you definitely don't apply in this example…)
I'll give them some d*ck but to be the only/main chick or wife GTFOHWTBS…
Women have to choose what they do in their prime VERY Carefully & learn from other women's mistakes…
#ThatIsAll
Marriage is not about rings or ceremonies…it's about the commitment in your heart, mind and soul. Without the commitment, NOTHING else matters.
If a man is telling a woman, the time isn't right…he is ultimately saying he is not ready to marry HER. I have seen several men say that to the loyal lady that's been there 8+ years all to get married to the next one in less than 2 years.
This is not saying that the woman he is with is not good—he just may be thinking that she's not good FOR HIM.
I hear you about the happy marriage, however, let's not sugar coat things here. There will be happy times, but those BAD times will make the happy times look far and few in between. And THAT is what you have to be realistic about. We have all been in relationships and marriage will be the same way, just harder to walk out on. There will be times (weeks or months) that the grass will look greener somewhere else. You have to see beyond those times because it is not the fighting itself that will cause you to divorce…it HOW you fight…because YOU WILL FIGHT…lol.
*writes down advice frantically* You know, I don't want to put his business out there (I'm comfortable putting mine out there but not his lol) but I will say that I believe he has issues with marriage in itself (due to his own past) more so than he does with his love for me. He has said many times that I am the best thing that's ever happened to him but obviously that's not enough. That's why I left. I realized that no matter how much of a bond we have, he'll never be able to give me what I want. His needs are simple (no diss) however mine or more complex. Also, our love languages are different. I've adapted with the "he's just a man" theory but the distance has shown me that I need more than what I'm accepting. I know marriages can be heaven/hell. I don't mind hard times and can withstand alot but like you said, the good has to be there.
*waves at Beef Bacon and the Bacon Bit*
Speak on it!! The questions is not, "Will I be happy with my man?" it's, "Can I live with this bamma for the rest of my life and not KILL him in his sleep?" LOL – I'm still in the honeymoon phase of my marriage, but I promise you that spouses, much like children, are designed to work your dayum nerves. It's your love that keeps them safe from you.
LMAO@Teflon!! Good point. I watch that show Snapped thinking THIS is how men come up missing everyday. They're lucky we love them.
I haven't read SFG response to that… But dat was ill
For years I thought I wanted to be straight financially before I got married…….but now that I am……I realize I just don't want to be married. Now that I have what I want financially. I suspect many men are the same way. You think its the money until you have the money and then you realize its not.
I also realize that the few times in my life I have considered marraige…..it was the quality of the women that made me consider it. Most women are doing some variation of the 6 things Terry outlined. The women I have considered knew how to treat a man. Plain and simple. I've been with too many women where it felt like the women was just another problem to deal with instead of something wonderful to come home to.
Just my two cents
What you are saying is true but not for everyone. I met him when I was 19. (I'm 30 now) I was young-minded, spoiled and a b*tch. I didn't know how to be anyone's partner as I was just a teen myself. The first 2years were terrible. But then I grew up. I matured. My priorities changed. I was able to be a better friend, then a better partner. The notion that if we are great enough, he'd marry isn't true. Like I said above, I know alot of good women who men take for granted. Only when I left did he propose and I don't want that.
Btw, I didn't forget that you called me a racist. I'm not crazy about you right now but I'm trying to learn the art of online debate and sh*t. I'm watching you though. lol
One thing a lot of women don't realize is that there are things you can do that eliminate you from being a wife. Men have feelings too. Sometimes women just go too far and a guy starts thinking he will never marry her. I've warned women before that men often keep things like this to themselves. Like a man might know you cheated and not say anything. He will stay with you. But then the girl is wondering whey he won't marry her cause she thinks he doesn't know.
Everyman has an idea in his head of a perfect wife and once you step outside those boundaries you're out of contention even if he stays with you.
I think every women should ask their man what their idea of a perfect women or wife is and then ask yourself how close you are to that.
No shots at you, so please don't get offended but..
God put man on earth to be fruitful and multiply. He also commands a man to take a wife. He also defines sex outside of marriage as sin. Playing by those rules, i'm pretty sure God intended for us to be married.
I also see marriage as a sign of success and virtue. It's "suposed to be" the beginning point of family. Family is how we establish our lasting legacies in the world and upon society.
As for me and what I believe in; Not all players who play the game will win a championship. They may play and win individual accomplishments, they may be high-skilled, and they may be considered "great." My goal is to win the championship though. I don't think I could be a player like Karl Malone or Charles Barkeley, playing my whole career and never winning the ultimate prize. Something about those careers seems less than adequate.
God put man on earth to be fruitful and multiply.
____________________________
Debatable. The whole idea of nuns and monks is rooted in a life lived to serve God. Singleness frees one to devote him or herself fully.
And when debating things about Christianity, keep in mind that the Catholic Church has a way of twisting things to serve a purpose.
Sidenote, i'm cool with all the people here who don't want to be married but are married to the church. Does that include any of those reading here who are single and not looking to get married?
Didn't think so. Next question.
@Grand Nagus
I hear you, I do. I'm not saying I'm perfect but I'm pretty sure that it's not me at this point. lol He doesn't want me to leave and has proposed again but I don't want him to use the proposal as a means to make me stay. We have so many diff factors that are getting in the way. I've never cheated, I treat him like a man, I respect him, etc. Our relationship was deep and not shallow. Like Dr. Jay said, not all players will win a championship and some people don't even play to win. It all depends on how much importance a man places on marriage.
Smart Fox….I believe you. If I met the perfect women at this point in my life I don't know if I would marry. I've known men and women that lived their entire lives together and never married. But basically lived as husband and wife.
J……Does one have to wear a robe and rock a friar tuck haircut to be devote his life to God. Espciacially if one believes the church is corrupt…why would one join that establishment.
But seriously….there are parts of the Bible I question. I am a Christian but not one that believes the Bible word for word.
To me the idea that a man is only complete with a family is an idea limited by mans understanding of the world when the Bible was written.
Not to get to existential but I believe their are states of existence equal or greater than what we know as life on Earth. I question whether or not I would want my spirit tied to this planet for eternity.
OK did I take it to far? ROFL
Duce,
Welp, if you want to get technical, Priests and Nuns are "married to the church", not God. So if you think the church is corrupt, not sure that applies to you.
But to bring this back to the post, women here's my recommendation… if a man vehemently defends not wanting to be married, you should probably not deal with him, if you planned on getting married, lol.
Thank you Dr. J (last point you made)
LOL I think just about everyone in America is a racist to some extent. Don't take it personal.
.
There are only a few that were put here on earth to serve GOD without the assistance of a family.
If you are a TRUE nun or monk (celibate and all) than great but only a few can remain chaste for long periods of time. If you have sexually urges, you should be married. That is not debatable.
His first command was to be fruitful and multiply…because only a FEW (very few) are called to do his Will without a family
I think so too Duces
"I’ve been with too many women where it felt like the women was just another problem to deal with instead of something wonderful to come home to."
THERE IT IS!!!!!!!!!!
"Many other emotions can cloud my judgement as I am loyal to a fault"
That’s exactly why women SHOULD NOT have sex with men until they are married! That oxytocin is SERIOUS BUSINESS! It will have you bonded and in love with ANYONE. People take those chemicals and the spiritual science behind those chemicals as jokes. I didn’t do it, but you better know that my daughter and son will know better.
I always say that The Creator is The Scientist! He knowingly used things within the body to bond us together. Women have this chemical and therefore they are the ones that should BE CAREFUL when sharing themselves sex.ually.
I tried explaining this not too long ago and some of the women on this blog called me crazy when I said it doesn't matter how much you claim someone is just a ufck-buddy. If you sleep with them enough times you will develop feelings for them.
It will have you bonded and in love with ANYONE.
Speak On It!!!!
This topic is a blog in itself
#CO-SIGN
BAM! I completely agree. I'm not knocking anyone who's into casual s.ex. I just know myself. I get attached and quickly. Because of this, I stay away from giving myself to people who don't love me. I graduated highschool and spent my freshman year of college a virgin while everyone thought I was lesbian or crazy. I just couldn't because I know myself and my emotions. The guy I'm talking about, who I dated for 10 years solid is my first and the father of my child.
Yeah, marinate on that. lol
SFG, I cosign your comments so hard, even if the Majority did tear them apart. As a woman, where is the effing line? Someone has to give a little. Never ever in the history of time were two perfect people wed and losers, and bitches, and sluts and selfish people get married every day.
I'm not trying to be married. I'm trying to have a successful marriage while being true to God, myself, my husband and our family. Some leeway will have to be made. If that means that I'm ignoring my logic for the greater good then so be it.
I saw your 10 questions on max-logic where you mentioned saving certain things for your husband and I applaude you for that. That's kind of how I am. I thought this man was going to be my husband one day. He was my first and for 10 years was my only…plus the father of my child. I got older and realized hope and love are not enough to keep me in this union. People tearing my comments apart doesn't bother me because I know I'm being honest and advice is VERY easy to give in comparison to taking it. It's easy for people to tell you what you need to do AND most of the times, we already know. It's emotion that gets in the way and as a woman, I'm full of it. You know what you want so it's good you're sticking to it. I'm trying to get there. lol
Being a b@tch, shallow and selfish…..basically some women make being with them so much work and so emasculating that most men would rather be alone. I mean who wants to be with someone that complicates and adds negative energy to their life? Especially if your fine by yourself.
My new mantra for 2011 is "Men just want peace." It aint even 6 things it's just 1. If you make your man feel at peace….if you can add peace to his life he will want to be with you. If you add struggle, strife, negative energy and insecurity to his life he will not wife you.
[ It should be noted that a lot of women claim to want to be married, but don’t do anything to put themselves in a position to be married.]
There's TRUTH to this statement.
If I was looking for hubby Number Two right now or even a serious relationship for that matter I know I wouldn't be a contender. *shrug*
I have no problem saying that I fall into at least 2 of those categories…. I am enjoying Just Being Me right now and I feel like I've earned the right to be any one/two of those six reasons for a minute.
Every woman has at least 1 of the 6 things she mentioned from time to time. Don't believe the hype. Everyone can be b*tchy, selfish, etc at times. Perfect people aren't the only ones getting married. lol
That is true SFG – no one is perfect. I am sure it is understood that there has to be a balance of the good and bad traits though.
*goes to read article so I can speak on it*
Wow she is my new best friend *in my head* that article is so on point! *Makes mental note to cut all ties*
How many great quotes did she have in that article?
"Why? Because past a certain age, casual sex is like recreational heroin — it doesn't stay recreational for long."
"I have news: he will never "figure" this out. He already knows he can live without you just fine."
"The kids put the woman on notice: B!tch, hello! It's not all about you anymore! "
"The good news is that I believe every woman who wants to can find a great partner. You're just going to need to get rid of the idea that marriage will make you happy."
"Strangely, men understand this more than we do. Probably because for them marriage involves sacrificing their most treasured possession — a free-agent penis — and for us, it's the culmination of a princess fantasy so universal, it built Disneyland."
LOL the post jumped the shark already!
This article has just been forwarded to female friends, exes and any other female in my contact book.
The arguments are legitmate and plainly written. If you disagree or are offended by these statements, maybe it's time for self-reflection.
You’re a b*tch – nope
You’re shallow – nope
You’re a slut – debatable
You’re a liar – nope
You’re selfish – nope
You’re not good enough – debatable, most likely the answer
Bad timing – possibly, but that was His issue, not mine
You don’t really want to be married – FALSE!
It's always easier to take criticism from someone that is going through the same thing…you feel like they understand. Because Ms. McMillan in making those statements is also acknowledging that she too is some of those things.
Your clubbing example is so laughable and terrifyingly true. a) YOU are in the clubs too. b) the one that you find that you didn't actually do the clubbing with was most likely clubbing in her day too, just not with you.
I've found that many men truly, truly do not like to know the truth. Admit it. You want to pretend that your woman is was created in a laboratory the day before you met and you are her one and only life experience. No Weird Science.
If anything was left out, I'd say it was "You don't know how to play the game." There's definitely an art to it. And honesty is nowhere in the manual for dating.
I think "not knowing how to play the game" (which equates to refusing to play the game as far as I'm concerned) falls under the category of "you don't really want to get married".
Basically if it's true that men don't like the truth and you insist on shoving it down their throats because you're "team honesty" then your actions are not in service to your goals. And if your actions are not going to lead to your goal then how much do you really want to achieve it?
As I said above, I don't just want to be married, I want a successful marriage and if I have to "cheat" (i.e.- lie) to get it, you're right-I don't want it. I'd rather be single forever than to have a bad marriage based on lies and deceit.
The person that gets married first isn't the winner in my book; it's the person with the best marriage – and in my definition, honesty is included in a good marriage.
"I’ve found that many men truly, truly do not like to know the truth. Admit it. You want to pretend that your woman is was created in a laboratory the day before you met and you are her one and only life experience."
lol! This is so true… and something I will NEVER understand…
Oh, I'm glad someone speaks on HONESTY…
I am good at receiving honesty, i just have to get better…
I'm gonna have to say that women could be just as bad (or worse) when it comes to the whole HONESTY thing…
The So-Called Black Male Vs. Black Female Gender War Proves that…
Anywho… we had this discussion before… I can't just walk up to a woman and ask for sex, or put it out there bluntly without some kind of backlash
in most cases… & that is why I am done being honest when it comes to getting some P*ssyThe smooth talker, & the deceptive men win in that department 9 times out of 10…
So when women complain about men not receiving honesty well, you HAVE to examine yourself first, I think most women are horrible with the truth, more than men…
"You’re a b*tch – nope
You’re shallow – nope
You’re a slut – debatable
You’re a liar – nope
You’re selfish – nope
You’re not good enough – debatable, most likely the answer.
Bad timing – possibly, but that was His issue, not mine
You don’t really want to be married – FALSE!"
FYI, when women scream there's only one word we use to describe them in our heads. Keep that in mind when using all CAPS and exclamation points.
Also, You're not good enough = You don't play the game.
Aside, the fact that you capitalized "His" leads me to believe you were dating Jesus. So I guess I can understand how it was bad timing, but that's just nasty.
Lastly, In The Mind of A Man, if whether you're a slut or not is debatable, then you are one.
The way men judge, Mary, mother of Jesus was a slut. Everything is open to the dude's interpretation…
Star you make no sense.
People judged Mary because she was not married to Joseph and women were not to have sex before marriage.
Unless you were mistaken and you were talking about Mary Magdalene, who was an actual prostitute.
Come on… you're making us waste time with these claims.
But she didn't have sex before marriage…that was only the perception…
Regardless, it was just an example. That chick that you loved, the one that got away, that you thought the world of? Perhaps just your mother if you haven't had a woman like that…yeah, some man thought she was a slut, and she may have been for him. But most people are not interested in reality, simply their perception of reality.
Real Talk Starita, that is the truth
I don't think my mom was a slut, but I would come to terms with it if she was… my sisters are definite sluts… It is what it isQuite honestly, the whole "slut" argument is so old. It's one of those that guys say but don't really mean it. One of my friends is the biggest slut ever, fooling around with just about every handsome guy in our hometown before moving on to a bigger town and doing the same. Yet she could start dating tomorrow if she wanted to. That's because she has something that beats slutty: the looks. She's a model, and guys just drool over her despite knowing her to be a bit on the "fast" side. The three times she's wanted to date a guy she's dated a guy. Unfortunately all of these relationships have crashed and burned, some sooner, some later. So looks doesn't give you everything, either.
But spare me this bullshit about these exact 6 things being "the reason". You can be selfish, bitchy, a slut, shallow, a liar, and even not good enough (though the definition of not being good enough eludes me), and you can still get married, if you happen to be at the right place at the right time. But if it's the wrong place at the wrong time, then even the most perfect person might not be "good enough".
Now, if you find yourself being at the wrong place at the wrong time A LOT, then you obviously need to look in the mirror. I'm just saying, in real relationships, there's more to people than meets the eye. It's always easy to give advice on the outside, but when you're actually living it, it will be much harder to just "walk out" and "use your brain".
Also, why are women the only ones wanting to get married? It's like soceity is telling women: "we all know marriage is a trap for men, it will make them unhappy for life and tied to only one woman, whereas for women it's a blissful solace of everything you will ever need in life. So if you want to get married, here's some tips you need to make you perfect enough for some man (any man, really) to want to marry you. And if they don't, lower your standards until you find someone who will!"
Interesting Post…
Men take looks too seriously, aka "Halo Effect"
"It’s always easier to take criticism from someone that is going through the same thing…you feel like they understand. Because Ms. McMillan in making those statements is also acknowledging that she too is some of those things."
Bam! Homegirl was married 3 times. I tried not to focus on her and just receive the message but that did not miss me. lol I cosign what you said. You can have flaws and still want to be married. Also, the man needs to accept honesty. We were not made for them or born into their laps. I never want to deceive to get anything in life.
95% of life is o so simple… This fall into the 95%…
I TRULY, TRULY believe that alot of women don't want to have a wonderful relationships/marriage… They rather complain than fix the problem… And they don't respect their PRIME years… They like to waste those years on a*ssholes & chasing unattainable men…
Women don't respect the Gender
DoubleStandards… If you want to be a woman of high esteem & get married one day… You have to… #EndOfStoryTracy McMillian HIT IT OUT OF THE PARK…
And so did you Dr.
Something is wrong, the last two posts do not show up in my google reader.
Fix it!!!
Thank you.
Loved this post because it was SO true.
We women demand so much from our men… but sometimes, we have to step our game up too. I'm not denying the fact that there are some super shady men out there… but if we're putting up with their nonsense… don't we share equal parts of the blame? And shouldn't we expect to find many of the same qualities in ourselves that we expect from the men we date? I mean… thats only fair.
This article really made me think. In the past year or so, I've been doing a lot of self reflection and although I think I'm a great person with some great qualities, I do realize that a common denominator in all my failed relationships is "me".
I've realized that I haven't quite yet become the woman that I feel like I need to be in order to be able to be the type of wife and mother that I feel would be a compliment to the type of man that I would want to marry.
There are still some specific things that I need to work on. So I'm okay with putting the work in right now. I have faith that when I'm ready… my husband will come. 🙂
This was a great post, beacuse it's so true. However one of the biggest misconceptions about this topic,which I'm sure Ms. McMillian is aware of although she may not have touched on it, is that WE (brothers) still marry these women! lol We realize that none of our female counterparts are perfect, ( neither are we), but a relationship is about finding the person who compliments you most, and one whom you can work with. The main issue I have with women is the "what can he do for me attitude?", No sister what can you do for that brother?
We are suppose to nurture one another, iron sharpens iron. We KNOW you're not perfect, but insight of your flaws you have major redeeming qualities. I feel brothers when honsetly trying to enter in a relationship take this into consideration, men are more use to settling, women are looking for the knight in shining armor. We how can I make this woman better, not only for me but for herself. A happy wife is a happy life, and in spite of my short comings, don't criticize me, help me grow. Let's work together, because how can I trust you to nurture my children if you can't do the same for me when I need it?
Excuse my spelling errors yall, typing too fast. I really felt this post! lol
This is factually correct.
Show of hands, how many people went on Facebook in the last 18 months and said?! "Wait! She's married now?!"
"You’re a b*tch, you’re shallow, you’re a slut, you’re a liar, you’re selfish, and/or you’re not good enough."
1) Pregnant women get married on the reg because they pregnant.
2) H*es get married on the reg because it's the best a dude ever had.
3) You might not be good enough, but if you hang around long enough, he'll come around.
4) Married women stay, "What's yours is ours and what's mine is mine." They still selfish.
5) I got a friend who's married to a chick who won't have sex with him because she don't like to sweat. She's a b*tch and shallow.
#5 is unacceptable! And like the homie said in, "why did i get married?" He has a legal right to get him some! lol
"I got a friend who’s married to a chick who won’t have sex with him because she don’t like to sweat. She’s a b*tch and shallow."
HA! Thank you for the best laugh I had all afternoon. Pack her bags and kick her to the curb. F* her. TOO FUNNY.
"Show of hands, how many people went on Facebook in the last 18 months and said?! “Wait! She’s married now?!”
You know someone probably thought that about ME when they saw the status change on my facebook. It's cool – some folks have a snapshot of you at a certain point in time and don't seem to realize that it's like 10 yrs old, lol.
That #3 is what happens often.. Girl hangs in there for like 10/15 yrs now she bitter cuz she is past her prime and ole buy realizes the chicks ain't checking for him like they use too before his hairline went in Reverse so now he decides to put a ring on it and have their 3 kids plan the wedding..
#5.. Wowwwwww. 'Got Em' that's all I can say about that. *lmao*
"We realize that none of our female counterparts are perfect, ( neither are we), but a relationship is about finding the person who compliments you most, and one whom you can work with."
No one is refuting that anyone is capable of being married. However, the hard part is finding out if the person you are with WANTS to be married to YOU as well. That is #1. Yes, all women will make some man a great wife and vice versa, but are you with that person NOW is the question.
Will I waste my time with Mike because I have three kids with him and we've been together 7 years OR will I take a risk and move on to meet my needs? The heart may heart and make all kinds of excuses when answering this but only the truth will set you free.
Bottom Line: If you want to be a wife and dude already have shown you that this isn't going to happen, please move on. I hate to see 50-year-old women being bitter because they held on too long. You can't change his mind. If you are okay with being JUST a girlfriend—carry on…but be honest when evaluating what you really want. Don’t tell everyone else, I am okay with….all the while dying on the inside because you are getting you true heart’s desire.
Also, it is important to remember that those conflicting thoughts and actions are seen by that man/woman as well. If you are constantly saying, I am okay that we are just boo’s but you really want to be married, isn’t that sending the wrong message?
You can lie to the world, but you can't lie to yourself for long. – Beef Bacon
*StompsFeet*
Wellllll…. *church voice*
PastorSisterMothernessBeefBacon from SBM.org mount oak tree with fig branches ministry for the wayward and uninformed is dropping sermon today.
I thought that the article was very on point, but I will focus on her last item, the "I'm not good enough" syndrome. For some reason we women buy into the notion that if we are just a little thinner/prettier/lighter/more successful/more giving/more whatever – that we will then be "worthy" of a man wanting to put a ring on it. This is not the case. I always told myself that if I only I quit smoking ciggies I would attract the "right" kind of man. But miraculously my husband, who has never smoked and hates smokers, ended up with me. And got me to quit. Now, maybe it was the extra strong margaritas I served him that evening, but he liked me more than he hated my habits.
It's not about meeting the "perfect" person or making yourself the "perfect" person. It's about finding the person whose dysfunction works well with yours.
"It's about finding the person whose dysfunction works well with yours."
A thousand times yes.
Tweeting it.
I actually think this was a perfect example of my argument, you found someone who took genuine interest in you despite what he saw as your short comings. And in the process he helped you kicked that habit, and your healthier because of it. Kudos to the two of you.
That "not good enough" complex is a serious issue, that's an issue i have with my significant other, she works in fashion and wants to be thinner. The girl weighs a buck25, if she get's any thinner she'll dissappear, why do women allow the pressure of outside forces weigh so heavy on how they view their relationship? If I like you the way you are, why do you feel you aren't good enough for me?
What I found really strange was the perception and approach people took to the article. I found it very interesting but seems like everybody has been focusing on the negative. She concluded by saying
Because ultimately, marriage is not about getting something — it's about giving it. Strangely, men understand this more than we do. Probably because for them marriage involves sacrificing their most treasured possession — a free-agent penis — and for us, it's the culmination of a princess fantasy so universal, it built Disneyland.
The bottom line is that marriage is just a long-term opportunity to practice loving someone even when they don't deserve it. Because most of the time, your messy, farting, macaroni-and-cheese eating man will not be doing what you want him to. But as you give him love anyway — because you have made up your mind to transform yourself into a person who is practicing being kind, deep, virtuous, truthful, giving, and most of all, accepting of your own dear self — you will find that you will experience the very thing you wanted all along: lOve.
All kinds of people get married and stuff. If you're lucky you meet someone who wants to make a
Commitment to
You for
The right reasons. Everything else is just happenstance.
Maybe women analyse stuff a whole lot more than men do. There seems to be this suggestion that the woman should look deep into herself as to why she's looking to get married. I'm not sure men do that much reflecting. If you're ready, you're ready.
Love her too!
Many women aren't married simply because men haven't decided to get married and marriage today is getting a very bad rap. At the end of the day, any woman can get married. Staying married is the bigger deal.