SBM: “So, I know you want me to come up stairs with you.”
Pretty Young Thang: “You know I can’t do that. Let’s end this night on a positive note.”
SBM: “If you let me come up, I promise it will be very positive.”
PYT: “It’s only our second date, and your not the type of guy I would take upstairs like that.”
SBM: “What does that mean? We’ve been having fun. I know your feeling me.”
PYT: *giggles* “Damn, you could tell? Yeah, it’s obvious I’m feeling you. You’re one of the better guys I’ve met in months. You really are ‘a good black man’.”
SBM: “I’m lost. What’s the problem? We’re adults right?”
PYT: *giggles* “Yeah, we’re grown. And yeah, It’s not that I don’t want to, but your too good. You’re someone I want to take to my mom, not my bedroom.”
SBM: “OK …” *blank stare* “So, because you like me and I’m nice and a potential husband, we can’t ‘enjoy each other'”.
PYT: “Exactly.”
SBM: “So if you were attracted to me, but I didn’t have any redeemable qualities, and I lived with my mom … I could go upstairs and get in your dirty dug out?”
PYT: “Exactly.”
SBM: “*$%&#@&!(*@!!!”
Oh yes … this is no joke. This is the curse of the Good Black Man and has afflicted me before.
I have been told by many women that men they’re interested in can be placed into one of two categories. This category will define the rules of engagement for the entire courtship.
Potential Husband
This is your typical “good black man”. He has a good job, a good education, knows how to treat a woman and has all the characteristics of a good husband. He is nice and a gentleman. This is the guy that every girl hopes to find and is happy when they find him. Within the Black community, he is becoming a rare commodity and sort of an endangered species, but we are still around if you look. When he is found, a woman feels the need to act a certain way. She doesn’t want to get thrown into the crazy, scuttlebutt, or jump off category … so she handles herself accordingly.
Potential FwB
This guy is the 20% in the 80/20 rule. He is attractive, mildly entertaining, and can sling pipe. He lacks most redeeming qualities as a man and it hard for most “professional” women to take him seriously, but he can serve a purpose.
We’re all adults here. Most of us are getting dug out or doing the digging. Most of us have either had friends with benefits, jump offs, or solid relationships that “go there”. But as a man, I was shocked to be told to my face that I was denied entry (the above example is based on real life … with a few changes) because I was too qualified for the goods this early.
Nuts …
I mean, when you think about it, it does makes sense. She was right, had she let me get it too easy I wouldn’t have been able to take her seriously. I hate to admit it, and I might get my card revoked at for putting out secrets, but I don’t want it if I don’t have to put in a little bit of work. It’s the same reason I can’t take most chics are the club seriously …
But still … I wanted to get in them guts.
And regardless, who wants to hear that their being turned down because they are too good? Who wants to know that the thing that makes you great is the same thing that is sending you home alone. It kind of makes you want to throw away that suit, grab a wifebeater, and give up your office to go to the mail room.
So, the curse of the Good Black Man will continue to strike. One day, just maybe, it will change.
Feel me? Am I making this all up? My women, do you do this? Ever not given it up in the hopes of getting more? Fellas, war stories?
– SBM aka Mr. Too Good aka I works for mine
![Eff a blog dog, cause one day we gonna MEET [RUH]](https://singleblackmale.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/6_ethugs_2.jpg)
I don't do casual sex… the cost is too high. I have to look at him and think, "Self, this man could end up being the father of your child…you could be "stuck" with him for the next 18 years"…I then ask, "Is he worthy."
So…
Only a good black man gets to climb up these stairs.
I'm celibate until marriage but I can certainly understand why a woman wouldn't want to ruin a good thing by sleeping with a GBM to quickly. GBM's are not for simply getting off, they're for marriage. The only mistake the woman in the example made is letting you know that if you had NO potential at all, you just might get the panties. I wouldn't want any man to know that I would otherwise sleep with him on the second date – even if it were true.
*rolls eyes*
Oh the hypocrisy.
There are men you F*ck and men you marry. If you want to be just the f*ck dude then let that be known and deal with it. But don't act all surprised when a chick (knowing men are full of sh*t and double standards) don't put out the goods early b/c she may want more then to be "dug out."
I concur 🙂
"Ever not given it up in the hopes of getting more?"
That's all I ever do……
sheesh!
😉
hmm… i actually think the good men are sexier and thus much more likely to get the 'goods'… but i still don't give anything right away.
a fwb, like the first poster said… may end up being the father of your child by some wild circumstance. and that's all you need is to end up with a baby by Tyrone 'nem. noooo thank you. lol. as i read somewhere .."never trust a big d*ck and a smile!" lol.
i do have guy friends who go through this though. i tell them to just look at it as being more special than casual thing. they still don't see it that way though. lol
You were wrong. She was clearly trying to build a relationship u were trying to hit. If a woman just goes off chemistry alone it puts her in a place that she is forced to fight to get out of (respect for the putnanee before personality). And the reason she is like that is to many times before following a wet dream can end up in a nightmare. Its sad we have to play russian roulette with our cooch in order to obtain a relationship
Jessense I have to throw the yellow flag on the play for this comment. How can you call SBM wrong? You cannot assume that from 2 dates that shorty was "trying to build a relationship" with SBM. Maybe she was simpin him out for free dates? (#noshots frat) Maybe she enjoyed his company? Maybe she wanted to make sure she really wanted to let son hit and is just saying the right things in order to smokescreen her true motives?
To say that he's wrong for wanting to hit is like saying I'm wrong for breathing. Two people attracted to each other, will express this in many ways, feel me? We're all adults, so whatever you choose is whatever you choose. Doesn't make SBM "wrong" though.
I'm late, but I agree with Streetz.
I don't blame her for turning me down and actually commend the chic for making me earn it, but you can't say I was wrong for trying to beat. The male mind is focused on beats and the female mind must be the one to control this.
I'm lost. You complain most of the time of jump offs and chicks who are too easy, and that you'd dismiss an easy piece in a quickness. You brag about how much you respect a woman who would rather make you work for it. Then when you have a good woman with sense, who knows her value and her worth, and is upfront in letting you know that she'd rather slow it down as opposed to being your one time deal….you're upset, bewildered, confused?
It seems that part of the frustration is likely that it's not as if she's abstinent until marriage, or has some 3-month rule to which all men are subject. Rather, there are occasions on which apparently she would just let a man smash, and I suspect that it's a bit jarring to hear that being a "good" man has created more hoops than those faced by the possibly no account jump-off, the one night stand with whom could equally result in pregnancy and a contentious 18+ year relationship.
I so agree sbm like most do not know what they want They just want
Renae, I was thinking the SAME thing…good post.
Tis the way of the world my friend, and really – what are you complaining about? You're on the second date, and if you thought that line would fly you wouldn't be on a second date, you'd have already been at her house "eating chips" and "watching a movie".
Don't get me wrong, we expect you to try us (let's us know we still got it) but if you're already going the date route you (usually) can't detour to the jump off rest stop. You could have wrapped that convo up much easier and earlier instead of pulling the "we're adults" move. After all, she just let you know that she's feeling you. She's not going to have you waiting for 6 months to catch a whiff. You're old enough to know how to obtain easy a**, so don't burden a woman who knows better with extended logical arguments as to why she should give you some on a 2nd date.
Anna They always gonna try lol And true all adults here know If a woman is feeling you and put it out there thats the reason for no nuk nuk so fast Respect that and respect her Its called building something You will get the nuk nuk Be patient
This is exactly the way I think. Sex with a man either means nothing or everything. So if there's something about him that makes him ineligible for potential boyfriend status, he can get it right away. (Actually if he's an abhorrent human being he can get it right away because that will usually make him disappear quicker) But if I'm feeling him and I can see it going somewhere, then he has to wait so it can be "special".
Yess, it's like you're in my head because this is EXACTLY how I feel. I was just involved in a relationship where I didn't see it going anywhere from jump, and next thing I know, Wham-Bam-thank you Man! If giving it up early compels a man to get bored and not stay around, then it doesn't feel like a lost when this guy decides that he's on to the next one. I should probably stop playing around though cuz Karma is an ITCH!
Not getting it on the second date shouldn't make you feel "cursed". She was being smart. Have we had time to go to the clinic and see each other's results by a second date? No? Well then, no nookie for you. Maybe I'm just really old fashioned, but casual sex has too many physical AND emotional downsides for it to appeal to me.
I do look sideways at people who have been dating for a year and only hold hands to stay chaste- that's waaaay extreme. But then again, some people just have low libidos. To each their own, but that wouldn't be me either.
All that about getting checked is true, but I think that the point (and why he's construing it as a curse) is that if he weren't a "good man" the health check and all that wouldn't have even been necessary.
Hela Yes that much of the infor Should have been kept to herself lol
I could have called it the great paradox or "life's irony" … but curse just rolls off the tongue better.
I mean … I was turned down because of how good I was and how much she liked me. If that aint a curse … IDK what is.
Just getting back in this 'dating' game and it seems like 'good women' or 'nice girls' have the same issues. I say let your intentions be known but stop with the games. Agree with the above poster that you mentioned she can't give it up too soon but then say why can't you get it?
Make up your mind. You either want it, hit it and continue with the relationship or you want to wait and let the relationship grow before you hit it. Either way, there are choices to be made and consequences and repercussions for each one.
You speak the truth brotha!
I think some of the women here, although bringing up valid points, are missing the context in which this post was written. This is the key line from PYT: “It’s only our second date, and your not the type of guy I would take upstairs like that.”
Given that she said he’s “not the type of guy” indicates she would bring a different type of guy upstairs on the second date. The point is the good guy is sometimes too good for his own good. Even the good guy isn’t ready to settle down at all points in his life, but being “good” makes it harder to have friends with benefits or jump-offs.
Granted, SBM can speak for himself, but that fact needs to be pointed out.
We get the context, we're just not sympathetic because this is the EXACT SAME THING men do, lol! Y'all act like you've never seen some girl, thought she was a dime and then she opened her mouth and started talking like a penny. Does it stop you from trying to hit? No, it just stops you from trying to wife her. You spend some time with the person and size them up as either relationship material or jumpoff material. I know it seems trifling that some women are willing to give up the goods to Pookie n'em while holding the GBM to a higher standard, but SBM already knows why: y'all are holding us to a higher standard as well. He admits he wouldn't have looked at her the same had she let him come up. Pookie is not so picky, and even if he is who cares? He's Pookie.
To be Pookie then, you gotta be Pookie now
What I was trying to exemplify with my post was nothing more than an interesting catch 22 that afflicts us. I admit that it does kinda make sense, but its damning to hear that you are getting denied for doing everything right. Very offputting.
Anna N: ”We get the context, we’re just not sympathetic because this is the EXACT SAME THING men do, lol! … I know it seems trifling that some women are willing to give up the goods to Pookie n’em while holding the GBM to a higher standard…”
My point still stands. Women may not be sympathetic, but that was the point being made, good guys have to wait when losers get the goods immediately.
Summary: “So, the curse of the Good Black Man will continue to strike.” (GBM lose, losers win)
Questions:
“Am I making this all up?” (no)
“My women, do you do this?” (yes)
“Ever not given it up in the hopes of getting more?” (yes)
I can understand where she was coming from…but, maybe, she shouldn't have put all of that information out there. It's the second date, she doesn't have to explain the why's and whatnot's of why she isn't taking you upstairs. She should have just said "Im not ready"…..or kept it simply vague. She talked too much. Women, sometimes we talk too much…she played herself, in a way.
i have never explained why you aren't getting the cookies, you just aren't getting it. I don't do the casual dating either…SBM, this woman obviously, was feeling you and she thought she was doing the right thing but you probably didn't end up with her anyway..or did you?
It would be hard for SBM to want such a woman after she has told him in a way that she has poor-decision making skills. I feel a woman that exemplifies poor-decision making is a woman who would screw a man she feels is a lesser man because she thinks this man is more than likely to just "hit it" or God forbid she get's pregnant, the man is more than likely to not take care of his child. But, she won't have sex with the man that she is feeling mentally and physically, and the man that has attributes of a potential husband.
Maybe this is a stage that some women go through but for us "good Black men" it gets old real fast.
I will admit … this scenario is changed a little. She actually told me the truth months later after we started dating more seriously, but that doesn't make for as good of an intro.
But … I was really turned down because of my "good man" status, so I'm not just making it up.
I dont think us men take issue w/ not getting any b/c it happens to us all the time. I think the issue is that we cant get any because we are/ have been doing everything that we were supposed to do to get the vag stache. Its kind of lends itself to the whole good guys finish last argument
This: "the issue is that we cant get any because we are/ have been doing everything that we were supposed to do to get the vag stache" is where many GBM get messed up. If you're treating a women really well just hoping to get in her draws you're waaaay off base. You treat a woman well to get the good woman in your life. This comes complete with vag stache, home cooked meals, emotional support, etc.
SBM, why you mad son?! Like you don't have some young breezies on speed dial. You stay frontin!
i would like to think that i'm a good guy. if a woman told me what was said in the example i wouldn't be too messed up with it. now if she tried to play me time and time again, then that's when i would take issue with it. i woudn't even want it from her on a first date anyway (not saying that i haven't had sex on a first date). its something that comes with the territory. either deal with it or don't. i'm not changing who i am just so i can fuck. *shrugs*
such is the curse of the "Good Black Man"…
either you don't get the buns, or you're placed in the friend zone…the greatest place in the world…
Although you, SBM, as a "Good Black Man" have needs, i guess its supposed to be some kind of backhanded compliment that you are the husband material (as opposed to male-jumpoff material that women have on speed dial?). So accept the compliment and and as you walk down the stairs, don't worry about that guy going UP the stairs…
i think
I think sometimes the more a woman wants someone, the more pressure she feels to be on best behavior.
"You're not the type of guy" means I WANT you and care what you think about me.
The good black man theory has been around for a minute, but I just found out that I'm probably going to die alone with 10 cats!!!!! I can't run off a "good black man" by letting my freak flag fly too soon.
You really are too good for your own good. Sorry.
A man who I don't have as much esteem for is easier for me to bed because I know I don't necessarily want him. If you play me or never speak to me again because you think I'm a ho bag for doing WHAT WE BOTH WANTED in the first place (#unfair)…hey, no big deal, you didn't have everything I wanted anyhow. The double standard is an easier pill to swallow if you really just don't care.
But let a man come around who has the right combo of looks, personality, and ambition/smarts….You can bet I'm doing whatever I can to prevent it from being a wrap too soon.
@ QueenT, I agree. She shouldn't have gone into the why's. Just like I didn't tell my j.o that he's my j.o because he has none of the qualities I look for in a real candidate, I would not tell a 'good man' that I'm NOT sleeping w/ him because he's 'too good" . Either way it makes me look sort of effed up.
Men always want to talk about women being confusing/conflicting/crazy, but men are too in some respects. You want women to give it up as quickly as possible, but then you don't want the woman that gives it up as quickly as possible. This is a self-preservation move on the part of the woman who wants to be more than just cut buddies with you, so take it as a compliment and STFU. If a woman has some sense, she'll "take it upstairs" with the guy she doesn't care if it goes nowhere with, because she knows there's a high likelihood she'll end up thrown into the jump-off category herself if she does. This isn't about your worthiness, it's about playing into the oxymoronic timing game.
If men would stop making negative assumptions about women who do exactly what you hope she will do and give it up quickly and then treating her like the condom you just disposed of, maybe y'all wouldn't have this problem. But that's not going to happen. So you just have to deal with it.
YES YES YES!!! I agree 100%
Well said! Like we created the dynamic? I think NOT!
What was negative?
I swear I gotta start putting stuff in bold a lot more.
I completely understood and respected her for what she did, but at the end of the night I went home alone because I was a potential husband type. It's the type of irony that you just gotta tell somebody about.
Ya'll are my "somebody!"
Haha, good post. I guess it depends how you value respect. Like they say, a man doesn't "respect" a women who gives it up too easily. So, wouldn't the same apply to women? There are always articles about men not respecting an easy lay and it appears to be because lots of women value that over getting the goods (not all do, and contrary to popular belief, plenty could give a f*ck and want the goods just as bad if not more than the dude). I guess the question is do men ever value the respect of a woman more than thronxing? Like, is the respect of a woman ever worth waiting a bit? Guess it depends on the woman, but I want men to chime in here. When is it worth it?
PYT: “So, I know you want me to come to Thanksgiving dinner at your mom's house with you.”
SBM: “You know I can’t do that.”
PYT: "Why not?"
SBM: “It’s only our [insert whatever # you feel is appropriate here] date, and you're not the type of woman I would take to my mom's like that.”
PYT: “What does that mean? We’ve been having fun. I know your feeling me.”
SBM: “Damn, you could tell? Yeah, it’s obvious I’m feeling you."
PYT: “I’m lost. What’s the problem? We’re adults right?”
SBM: “Yeah, we’re grown. And yeah, It’s not that I don’t want to, but you’re someone I want to take to my bedroom, not my mom.”
PYT: “OK …” *blank stare* “So, we've been going out often, seeing each other at least once a week, I've rejected all these other guys and opportunities I've had to date other men because I was trying to focus on you and us and what I thought we had and you've been inside of me, but I'm not good enough to meet the woman who gave birth to you?”.
SBM: “Exactly.”
PYT: "So, this really isn't going anywhere, huh? I've just been your jumpoff this whole time? You were never interested in anything more from me at all besides sex?
SBM: "Exactly."
PYT: “*$%&#@&!(*@!!!”
I think the girl in your example had a fear of ending up like the girl in my example.
Dang FLY! LOL!
See, I always assume I am a jump-off until otherwise stated. I mean, J.O is negatively connotated yes, but, if you aren't the main that what else do you want to be called…because, FRIEND is just a more respectful/nice way of saying JUMP OFF. It's all the same in the end….
Question Men: Should we assume we are J.O until you say otherwise? Because, in this example, you were treating her like a MAIN..so what is the difference? That is why women get confused.
QueenT, we as women shouldn't be confused at all because we shouldn't let men decide who we will and will not be as it pertains to a relationship. We should be the ones deciding. I am either the woman he is with or the woman he is trying to be with. In my relationships, if anyone is the jumpoff, it's him, until I say otherwise. And by jumpoff, in my world, it's usually financial rather than sexual (call it trickin if you want).
In SBMs example, the woman wasn't allowing him the opportunity to decide whether he wanted her as a jumpoff or potential wife. She was making that choice for him by removing that as an option.
I feel you. However, once you do decide to sleep with a guy you are seeing/dating without establing the full context of your relationship, then what? You can believe in your mind and heart you are not a JO but in his mind you could very well be a JO….or do you establish that first before you even sleep with him, in that case, you are good to go…..however, I find alot of women, and I have been guilty of this in my past as well, give out the cookie without really having full disclosure on the status of the relationship……(shrugs).
SBM to me was rushing things. The second date??? maybe, if he would've waited until the third or fourth or whenever it felt right for both of them? He was acting real thirsty to me……no offense, SBM. smiles.
@QueenT: I mean … in real situation I aint try that hard … but yeah … my throat was a little parched and I wanted to drink from her deep pond that night.
Aww well …
You're right … she did. And she was right for not letting me get it that early.
Men aren't always smart … we got a lotta testosterone messing things up for us.
But in your example, who is asking to go visit mom's without a title???? Where dey do dat at???
I feel you bruh, but you're damned if you try and damned if you don't.
I've had similar scenarios, but I've noticed that if you don't try for the cooch within a certain period of time or set amount of dates you get put into purgatory. On one hand she could respect you for being a total gentleman because you didn't try her, and if it goes on too long will probably put you in the friend zone or try to make you her gay friend. If you try to soon, according to them, then you're either a potential FWB or a panty ripping man-whore. The delicate balance between bold moves and good behavior could easily be teetered.
I TOTALLY agree with CPT Callamity…you are dead on with your perspective.
250% Co-sign
I feel you SMB – It's not like I haven't heard this complaint from my "good guy" friends. But really, the rules in this game were set a long time ago and we've just adapted. You are the architect of your own blueballs. Bottom line: women who show little discernment in who they sleep with or sleep with too many men are seen as slores. (workcite: any SBM post involving "numbers", "smashing of homies", "what he heard through the grapevine", etc.) Women still have working vajay-jays and occassionally need some action. Unfortunately, the way this system is set up it makes more sense to sleep with Mr. Wrong and let Mr. Right rub one out watching a Pinkie performance. And really, we assume that early in the game (date 2) that you already have some jumpoff to call once you leave our doorstep. We know you're not that pressed to get it.
If GBM were a little less JUDGEMENTAL about when they get some….y'all would get some, lol.
So agree Anna, You got the jo I got the jo Why rush the real Not enough women seperate sex with feelings More communication maybe? If we both know this about the other and hes still interested Hes even more intriged and interested in making you his girl now I would think But Im girl What do I know right
Couldn't have said it better.
The rules to the game weren't written by women. We don't WANT to be penalized for having sex. This is just IMO the only way to play it. After all, women need sex too. Unfortunately, you are going to be judged for doing so if its before a certain point. Its more about dealing with the potential fallout from whatever choice you make.
I wont make generalizations, but it has happened to me when my interest in him was apparent -he didn't have to question it- and, yes, we did it because *gasp* I LIKED HIM… A LOT. and he proceeded to throw me away like yesterdays trash.
Not how I wanted it to go, but its the way it is.
So don't feel bad good guys, we too are damned if we do/ damned if we don't.
I also assume that sex is a phone call away for all the men I date. You will be alright if I say no. Its the decade of the jump off. You don't NEED mine. Really.
I love the second point… lol. "If GBM were a little less JUDGEMENTAL about when they get some….y’all would get some, lol." Co-sign right there. If I think I know you are a GBM and maybe I want some and you want some… and we could continue on w/o your judging me… then hey everyone would be happy. But we all know it ain't going down like that.
I can't say that I haven't been judgemental myself… if he asked for some when I thought it was way too early… be may have gotten put in the slores zone. It is really all about the personalities involved though.
It makes sense if she's trying to get to know you a little better and doesn't want to be thrown into the gutter butt category. The problem arises when she doesn't want to have anything to do with you because you're "too good" or "too nice". But I'll admit, letting some dude that sleeps on his mama's couch hit is kinda sketch too….
That was a
premature ejaculationmistake on her part. It wasn't necessary for her to divulge anything to you other than "I had a good time" on a second date since no real connection has been formed yet. Yes, people have their little sexual urges they want to succumb to every now and then but if you're really trying to get to know one another on a more meaningful level, it's best to save all of that "Hot Wuk" for later…past the lust stage…unless, that's all you, as a good black man, wanted from her.CO-SIGN! I said that too! Nobody else seemed to want to comment on that point. The second date is way too soon for explanations and sh*T. I think, SBM was just trying to get a piece….I wonder if he will fess up to that? LOL.
The point isn't that she said it. The point is she feels that way in the first place. Even if she kept her mouth shut, she's still boinking the loser and the good guy has to wait. The good guy is not allowed to have a jumpoff or a FWB, he has to be in a relationship.
Although I agree, the second date is pretty early.
Hugh Jazz, I completely agree with you. That's a fundamental flaw on her part: having sex with low quality guys- part of that is a reflection of how she is. The point of my rambled thought is…it's a second date. She needs to calm her nerves with all of that future planning talk because she doesn't know SBM. Enjoy the ride. Janet Jackson's "Let's Wait A While" comes to mind.
Yeah, she really had a case of the TalksTooMuch because honestly, I'd be a little freaked out if a guy told me on the second date "I see you as wife material!" Whoa, do you even remember my last name?! Any budding relationship that comes on that strong in the beginning is bound to suffer from burn out sooner or later.
Well, he may or may not fess up to it but uhh sounds like it to me too! 🙂
exactly! Her game was wack. There are plenty of other things she could have said that got to the same result. But its possible that she didn't really mean it, and just didn't want to have sex with him. Could have been her way of trying to spare that part of his ego… #justsayin…
I do think this is a double edged sword. I've seen past posts where you kinda dog women out for giving up the goodies too quickly or sleeping with too many people – so basically it's damned if you do, damned if you don't sort of situation for the woman.
Consider my situation: I've had a small number of sexual partners and only have sex with people I genuinely care for, so the random FWB situation has never happened for me. But, even with a small number of partners, I kinda feel like sex was brought into the equation too quickly, clouding judgement.
I like a new guy now. I like him A LOT. He's a GBM And I want him…bad! But, I'm reminding myself to take my time, cause he's quality (as were the others, but I'm older now dangit – I've learned to keep the physical at bay a little longer). Good thing is, in return, I think he's doing the same with me. We both recognize some great qualities in one another and want to concentrate on getting to know each other before hitting the sheets. When you're feeling that type of lust for somebody, falling into bed can falsely intensify those "loving" feelings.
I say all that to say, GBM's shouldn't take it personally. I mean, I know you're still a man, so that's still of utmost importance, but patience pays off in the end!
if this situation is the poison to a GBM, then the antidote is a jumpoff.
that is all.
Fly: ” we shouldn’t let men decide who we will and will not be as it pertains to a relationship.”
I agree with this portion of the comment. In general, men are the pursuers and if a woman doesn’t want to be relegated to being a jumpoff, she should make a man wait and let the relationship develop. If a man is truly looking for a jumpoff and you make him wait, he’ll find that JO elsewhere and you keep your respect. All parties win.
”In my relationships, if anyone is the jumpoff, it’s him, until I say otherwise. And by jumpoff, in my world, it’s usually financial rather than sexual (call it trickin if you want).”
This part of the comment is what the whole post is about. Women can have JOs and be rewarded sexually and financially. Mr. Good Guy is SOL and has to go home to JILL (look at your right hand). Meanwhile the woman is getting broke off by Mr. Big Dyck Loser and receiving Fendi bags from Mr. Trick and Treat, while stringing poor Mr. Good Guy along until she is ready to settle down.
Of course, this is part of the game, and in the words of Mr. Shakur and Mr. Boy, I ain’t mad ya. But just realize men aren’t stupid and we learn from experience. Most guys who are naturally “good guys” get burnt enough times, then go through the phase where they will play the role of Pookie to get the nookie, even if it is against their baser nature. Then you wonder where all the good guys are…
this comment was well put and had plenty good points, however i disagree with one particular sentence "men aren't stupid"
yes we are. fortunately we are smart enough to know we're stupid and use it to our advantage.
You sure do Use it Ha!
Carver The Great: "this comment was well put and had plenty good points, however i disagree with one particular sentence “men aren’t stupid”"
I stand corrected. Men do stupid things, I won't argue that.
Hugh Jazz, I agree with you 100%. Nothing you said in either paragraph is gender specific though, and that was my point. Ms. Good Girl is SOL and has to go home to BOB (look in her drawer), register for match.com and read articles about how educated Black women are alarmingly single. Meanwhile, the man is getting broke off by Ms. Freak of the Week (while still trying to get Ms. Good Girl to sleep with you), while Ms. Good Girl is strung along until he's ready to settle down….Women aren't stupid and we learn from experience, too. Most women who are naturally "good girls" get burnt enough times, then go through the phase where they will play the game of "F*** you, Pay me", even if it is against their baser nature. Then you wonder what your ex has been up to, because she was a really good woman…
We are definitely on the same page Hugh. Eye to eye.
Nicely played Fly. Nicely played.
Why do people always think I'm mad??? Damn, can't someone just point out a minor annoyance in their life.
In this real life situation I would respect her for her decision, put her in the wifey category, start planning the next date, and immediately leave her place to go see the weekday jump off to handle bidness. Don't like to be worked up and home alone …
Joking …
No your not
Joking
lol
But I agree and dont see you as mad Its just fustrating to be the "Good Girl" and not be able jump the Good Guys bones When I know hes worth giving up the goods
Interesting dialogue. In some roundabout and twisted way, I'd almost be kinda happy if I didn't get invited upstairs to the romp room after the 2nd date. I wouldn't be happy if I didn't get invited up and found out that someone else was going up the stairs within a few minutes of me getting my car and pulling off. Something about this post riles me up. I'm going to stop now.lol.
"Something about this post riles me up."
I think that it's the juxtaposition of the admission that under certain circumstances the PYT in view would have no problem giving up the goods early with her reasoning as to why she's not in this case. It would seem that if the issue is not wanting to be seen as easy or lose respect, why imply that if SBM were a "bad" dude she would open the cookie jar early and often?
I know personally there have been many times where I will try and withhold getting it in because I really like them.
But alas … Try is the key word. 85% of the time I succumb and then get bored earlier than I would if I had waited.
As much as I'm complaining, it truly behooves any woman to make us wait.
Sigh. It only behooves a woman to make ya'll wait if she is dealing with Neanderthals who seem to expect women to live by a standard they themselves can't deal with.
If you sleep with a dude and then he all of a sudden acts like you're the whore of babylon for doing what you BOTH wanted he ain't the type of dude you want to be with. F*ck him and his 1950's backwards ass values.
Your getting "bored" has nothing to do with the chick and everything to do with the load of misogynist BS you (and your ilk) apparently feed on to uphold some archaic version of the Patriarchy where all the men are studs and all the (good) women are damn near virginal waiting for their prince charming to come along and take care of her.
Considering Prince Charming these days wants to have a 9 to 5 AND still take care of the kids (and him in the bedroom) then – once again I say – F*ck him and his sexual values. If i want to F*ck you i will. If I don't I want. No explanation needed.
And if you have a problem with either scenario then you can keep it stepping 'cause beleive me there will be a man to replace you.
This dating game is tough. Wear a cup.
Funny, I'm actually in this situation right now! There's this guy whose super nice, but I just don't see us getting much further than the physical. So I'm basically like, well, since I know we're not going anywhere, there's nothing to lose by getting down a little bit. That way, if the guy gets bored and decides to move on, there aren't any hurt feelings because he wasn't going to make the cut anyway!
But if the guy has some great traits that we desire in a man, withholding the goody bag gives us time to make a decision about each other untainted by the sex and focus on those good qualities.
I agree with SBM..
The guy that I'm currently dating is a "Good Black Man"..I let him wait because I wanted him to stay around..My hunni is still around.. If I wanted a hit and quit..he would've been out of the picture..
Great post SBM..
I used to get that., but I think I was thinking the same thing(good black man curse). To me, it was more along the lines of the friend zone.
If you wanted to hit, you needed to let her know from the jump. Second date or not. She has already made it up in her mind 15 minutes in if she wants you too, so its no surprise.
To answer your question, yes, I have done this. The only difference is I didn't realize I was. I didn't have a premeditated plan and explanation to say why. But I definitely did this. I know that there are women who guys take to see mama, and women who guys smash on a consistent basis. But what's wrong with a woman knowing what she wants in a good guy AND giving up the goodies? I don't see anything wrong with that, lol. Especially after realizing that that whole theory of "you're too good to get it" is not so smart. Ok. I'm done.
God bless @a big butt and smile for she speaks the gospel. I read your blog and I hardly ever comment but the misogyny and reasoning for double standards amaze me. If you just wanna boink around that's what prostitutes are for. Don't deal with a "good" woman and expect her to abide by the warped protocol you set for the fairer sex. Its so awful how women just can't be people. We have to think like clerics concerning everything we do.
If you have ever slept with a "good black man" too early and then tried to un-do the FwB relationship that you've built up- you will understand how difficult that method is versus just holding out a bit more. Despite having a million guy friends repeatedly tell me that you can't turn a FBuddy to a Girlfriend, it wasn't until I started sleeping with someone I really liked and have had to spend the past few months trying to get us to start from square one that I realize in the future- all good black men get the "not tonight" treatment.
I think the wildly overused term "good black man" should include one more line item in the definition; "One who forgoes short term pleasure in order to seek lifelong fulfillment, aka a wife". Just my 2 a day and half late…
…And there is it.
For women: Its all about having to face them afterwards. If he is a GBM and there was/is potential, then there may be some shame, if it is too soon and he rejects you later. If it is someone that you do not want, you do not care. It becomes your choice.
It is ironic that the one you like the most initially gets the least.
This is not a 'good black man' issue, this is not even a 'black' issue. This has been going on for centuries with all men.
I feel it's time for us to let go of all the antiquated rules that have no revelence to our lives today. Plus, if a man were to look down on me for doing the EXACT same thing he just did, I would be glad that he eliminated himself from my life, thus saving me from a lot of wasted time.